SHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3661 posts, RR: 19 Posted (11 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 6003 times:
I'm starting this out with YYC, doing them by destination, and throwing them up as I finish, using the July 26th date FSDan is using in his other threads. A great thanks to FSDan for his other work, and for the inspiration:
SHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3661 posts, RR: 19 Reply 1, posted (11 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 5913 times:
SHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3661 posts, RR: 19 Reply 2, posted (11 months 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 5751 times:
Before I do YYZ, one stupid question...how does Air Canada manage to fill a daily 767-300 to Bogota that leaves Toronto at 8 o'clock in the morning?
SHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3661 posts, RR: 19 Reply 3, posted (11 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 5662 times:
FSDan From United States of America, joined Jan 2011, 623 posts, RR: 2 Reply 5, posted (11 months 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 5164 times:
AC seems to be quite heavy on the RJ and turboprop flying on everything that is not international or hub-hub flying. Fairly impressive amount of long-haul flights, though.
SFO LAX ONT DEN IAH DFW OMA FSD MSP MSN MKE ORD DTW MEM JAN BHM RSW ATL CLT PHL LGA JFK KEF LHR LGW MAD
longhauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4275 posts, RR: 36 Reply 7, posted (11 months 2 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 5121 times:
Quoting SHUPirate1 (Reply 2): Before I do YYZ, one stupid question...how does Air Canada manage to fill a daily 767-300 to Bogota that leaves Toronto at 8 o'clock in the morning?
I do this flight a lot.
J is almost always full, and Y probably 75% full on average.
Freight is certainly a consideration as well.
Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
YOWza From Canada, joined Jul 2005, 4781 posts, RR: 17 Reply 10, posted (11 months 2 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 4833 times:
Quoting SHUPirate1 (Reply 2): how does Air Canada manage to fill a daily 767-300 to Bogota that leaves Toronto at 8 o'clock in the morning?
With the political situation being more stable and the unrest quelled there is a lot of Colombia-Canada trade and I would suspect travel. There are bout a dozen "Colombian" natural resource companies traded on the TSX and ScotiaBank has a massive footprint in the country too owning a majority share in Banco Colpatria.
When it comes to AC and Latin America people love to endlessly talk about the same thing:
- direct EZE service
- tagging MVD onto GRU
- up-gauging GRU, EZE, SCL year round
- potential GIG service
but in reality the action is further north. With better political situations and investment in place CCS, BOG, LIM, PTY and secondary cities in the same countries are looking more and more interesting.
RKSofACinUSA From United States of America, joined Jan 2012, 27 posts, RR: 0 Reply 11, posted (11 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 4739 times:
Quoting SHUPirate1 (Reply 2): Before I do YYZ, one stupid question...how does Air Canada manage to fill a daily 767-300 to Bogota that leaves Toronto at 8 o'clock in the morning?
There are decent connections from YYT, YHZ, YFC, YSJ, YYG, YQB, YOW, YUL, YYC, YEG, YVR, SFO and LAX.
jonathanxxxx From United States of America, joined Feb 2011, 637 posts, RR: 1 Reply 13, posted (11 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 4470 times:
Wow... Only a single E-190? That's horrible... Gonna be hard to compete with 2X daily (?) AA..
Honestly it seems AC is slowly abandoning south FL. Gone are the days of 5x MIA-YYZ with 767s and 747s and 4x FLL-YYZ with A320s and 767s for the winter (yes ok that's quite a while ago...). I guess AC decided that cruise traffic wasn't sufficiently profitable?
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RKSofACinUSA From United States of America, joined Jan 2012, 27 posts, RR: 0 Reply 16, posted (11 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 4331 times:
Quoting jonathanxxxx (Reply 13): Why would somebody do SFO-YYZ-BOG or LAX-YYZ-BOG... Maybe from SEA or PDX but not LAX or SFO...
Price? Schedule? Preference of a Canadian carrier over a US carrier? Why is it that different than connecting SFO/EWR/BOG on UA?
polaris From Canada, joined Feb 2000, 1118 posts, RR: 1 Reply 17, posted (11 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 4302 times:
Re: the Florida comments - when Air Canada served only Tampa and Miami, there were more flights with larger aircraft into those two cities. Service was from Toronto and Montreal. Now, Air Canada serves seven cities in Florida from four Canadian cities so there are more flights to more cities. Granted, some flights are seasonal but that's still seven Florida cities vs two a number of years ago. Cities served: Miami, Ft Lauderdale, West Palm Beach, Fort Myers, Sarasota, Tampa, and Orlando. Served from: Halifax, Montreal, Ottawa, and Toronto.
Let's not forget the emergence of WS and WG and Canada's changing demographics. There is now a sizable non-citizen immigrant population that needs to jump through hoops for visas for the US. This body of people can just pitch up to many sun destinations in Caribbean and get a visa on arrival.
jonathanxxxx From United States of America, joined Feb 2011, 637 posts, RR: 1 Reply 19, posted (11 months 2 weeks 1 day ago) and read 4220 times:
Quoting RKSofACinUSA (Reply 16): Price? Schedule? Preference of a Canadian carrier over a US carrier? Why is it that different than connecting SFO/EWR/BOG on UA?
I doubt there are too many going through EWR either... If you need to go from LAX/SFO to BOG you can take AA through MIA, UA through IAH, TA through SAL, DL through ATL, and even AM through MEX or NK/B6 through FLL. Going through Canada or NYC just isn't worth it unless your going for mileage as posted above.
ANM604 From Canada, joined Feb 2012, 137 posts, RR: 0 Reply 21, posted (11 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 4080 times:
Quoting YOWza (Reply 10): When it comes to AC and Latin America people love to endlessly talk about the same thing:
- direct EZE service
- tagging MVD onto GRU
- up-gauging GRU, EZE, SCL year round
- potential GIG service
but in reality the action is further north. With better political situations and investment in place CCS, BOG, LIM, PTY and secondary cities in the same countries are looking more and more interesting.
I think in the future, especially with the arrival of the 787's, you will a lot more of AC going into South America. It is such a huge, growing market, and not to mention substantial cargo traffic, which makes these routes very profitable. Like you mentioned, political stability in these countries has helped increased tourism between Canada and South America. Personally, I'm looking to go hike Machu Picchu sometime soon, and possibly spend a couple weeks jumping between countries!
Quoting northstardc4m (Reply 14): I guess AC decided that cruise traffic wasn't sufficiently profitable?
With WS and others now charging into the FL market, yields are probably not what they used to be. AC's strategy, as others have noted, has been increase service to different destinations from different Canadian cities. Picking up cruise traffic is not what it used to be, as people aren't buying air + cruise packages, but rather separating them and looking for the cheapest routes possible. Same thing goes for traffic increasing to other sun destinations; Canadians have proven they like to travel, and going to Florida isn't quite what it used to be. Lots of my friends and family are now going a little further out to places like Costa Rica and Belize for vacations; Florida is nice, but it sure isn't Costa Rica
longhauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4275 posts, RR: 36 Reply 22, posted (11 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 4050 times:
Quoting jonathanxxxx (Reply 13): Wow... Only a single E-190? That's horrible... Gonna be hard to compete with 2X daily (?) AA..
The majority of AA's MIA traffic is not going to MIA, but through AA's tremendous MIA hub to Latin America and the Caribbean. I don't see AA trying to compete with AC to TPA (1 320), MCO (3 320s) or FLL (2 320s).
Quoting northstardc4m (Reply 14): Honestly it seems AC is slowly abandoning south FL. Gone are the days of 5x MIA-YYZ with 767s and 747s and 4x FLL-YYZ with A320s and 767s for the winter (yes ok that's quite a while ago...). I guess AC decided that cruise traffic wasn't sufficiently profitable?
I remember when AC flew the B747 to both MIA and TPA, but per the bilateral, that was the only destinations in FLA allowed. Heck, I remember when AC flew the DC-8 to MIA, and the Vanguard to TPA! Passengers had to connect if their final destination was anywhere else. But during the summer, and with open skies, AC flies non-stop to MIA and TPA still, but also MCO and FLL. In the winter add RSW, SRQ and PBI.
Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
AeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 18805 posts, RR: 64 Reply 23, posted (11 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 4046 times:
Quoting jonathanxxxx (Reply 19): I doubt there are too many going through EWR either
People also look at the schedules. If you didn't want to kill an entire day flying, your two best options time-wise are actually B6 via FLL or AC via YYZ starting out on the red-eyes ex-SFO.
SHUPirate1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 3661 posts, RR: 19 Reply 24, posted (11 months 2 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 3967 times:
Quoting C172Akula (Reply 20): Regarding the YYC schedule I believe YYZ should also show 1x 763. As the AC NRT flight operates as YYZ-YYC-NRT and NRT-YYC-YYZ on the return.
Does that operate every day? I don't believe it does...
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25 JHCRJ700: I know it's a small plane but I would love to know what the load factors are on these flights. I'm outside all day for my job and saw one of the Dash
26 bakersdozen: It's a stupid time. I take this flight every month or so and in our winter and Colombia's summer it leaves ~2-3pm. 8 am flight runs during our summer
27 bakersdozen: Agree if you take CCS off the list. It's gone down the crapper the past few years and seems to continue to do so. Most of the business has transfered
28 YVRLTN: Ex YVR General observation, its interesting to see how the 190 is taking a lot of the A32S work, this route is a good example of one that used to be m
29 c172akula: You are correct, the 763 only operates the YYC-YYZ 1-2 times a week. The rest of the time the 763 turns around in YYC.
30 Corinthians: Stupid question and I don't have any time to look at the schedule, but does AC operate any red-eyes from California to YYZ?
31 RKSofACinUSA: Yes, from both SFO and LAX daily.
32 delta2ual: Are you kidding? I meet more Canadians in Florida than I do in Canada! LOL Seriously, I have a lot of cousins from the Guelph, ON area-and almost all
33 cyeg66: Wow, these lists support the fact of just how YYZ-centric Air Canada's mainline flights are. Over 220+ mainline from YYZ while YVR, YUL, and YYC have
35 longhauler: And why do you suppose that is? Air Canada, (and all airlines) have access to numbers of which we can only dream. They know exactly where the money i
36 bmacleod: I don't see YHZ in the YYC departure list, there should be at least 1 A320 flight.
37 cayman: Traffic out of Venezuela generally and CCS especially is booming given capital flight and lots of disposable income of Vzlans to travel. In addition t
38 RJLover: Not this summer. The non-stop is gone, replaced by another one stop thru flight (via YYZ).
39 pnwtraveler: If you add up the population in the golden horseshoe that YYZ draws traffic from you will get a good idea why the concentration of flights. Over 6 mil
40 cyeg66: I'll take you up on those numbers, pls. What you speak of is no mystery. Still surprising the sheer disproportion of the whole affair.(YYZ much >
41 Viscount724: YYC-NRT-YYC is 5 per week. The YYZ-YYC-YYZ sector only operates twice a week, Tuesday/Friday westbound and Friday/Sunday eastbound.
42 whiteguy: Quoting bmacleod (Reply 36): I don't see YHZ in the YYC departure list, there should be at least 1 A320 flight. Not this summer. The non-stop is gone,
43 vinniewinnie: I'd be interested to see all citypairs from YYC both from Air Canada and West Jet Alberta province/state is the jewel of North America. Oil sands draw
44 RJLover: Yep! Wasn't there only two YYC thru flights last summer (I was just saying that an additional one-stop thru flight added, not that there is only one
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I think in the future, especially with the arrival of the 787's, you will a lot more of AC going into South America. It is such a huge, growing market, and not to mention substantial cargo traffic, which makes these routes very profitable. Like you mentioned, political stability in these countries has helped increased tourism between Canada and South America. Personally, I'm looking to go hike Machu Picchu sometime soon, and possibly spend a couple weeks jumping between countries!
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